Re: Nein! Das ist wirklich!

Posted by odin from spider-wk041.proxy.aol.com on December 04, 1998 at 01:31:20:

In Reply to: Re: Nein! Das ist wirklich! posted by Max on October 02, 1998 at 09:04:59:

: : : : : : I can count at least nsistencies. Editing, people. Let's work on editing.

: : : : : : -The Grey Wanderer-

: : : : : I think that the General (Vogel) his rank is "StandartenFührer".
: : : : : It's some kind of German Nazi rank but I don't know what the same rank in Englisch is. It could be General.
: : : : : -Webley-

: : : : : Vogel was more likely not a General. Wearing the black ceremonial uniform identifies him as an officer of the Schutzstaffel or SS. If he was a general, he would have been referred to as Herr Oberst. Hard to tell what the rank is from just "Standartenfuhrer". Fuhrer is German for "leader". "Oberfuhrer" would have been a major... Vogel was probably a lieutenant colonel or full colonel. -MP

: : : I kinda always thought that Vogel was a Colonel so a "Oberst" in
: : : German. I never heard of a rank called "Standartenfuhrer" but I
: : : belive it's a term for the "leader" or the commanding officer of
: : : one regiment or so. I don't really think this is the same as a
: : : General. Also wouldn't a lieutnant colonel a "Oberstleutnant" and
: : : so still considered "under" the (full) colonel? Just my two cents.

: : : Regards,
: : : -Max

: : :Uhhgg. Max is right. I think "Oberst" really is German for colonel. Yes, a lieutenant colonel is indeed one rank below a colonel. (Same thing in our Army.)

: : Since the SS had names for the divisions (SS-Viking, SS-Adolph Hitler, etc.), I think Max is also correct that "Standartenfuhrer" probably refers to the leader of a specific SS formation. I think there was one called SS-Liebstandarte or Liebstandarten. The easiest way to tell is by looking at the sleeve braid on the black uniform coat. Inside the braid was written the name of the specific division to which the officer/soldier belonged. Hard to tell on the Vogel's uniform. He doesn't stay in that uniform for very long in the movie. -MP

: MP, I believe that "Standarte" refers to a number of units he commands
: or so. Identifying his rank insignia is pretty hard indeed. Also does
: he have such things on the kahki uniform he is wearing later in the
: movie? I really don't remember. Well anyway, I can't really see anything
: useful on his cap. Also I'm not really an expert but I think he wears
: some kind of close-combat badge on his collar. The shoulder thing isn't
: really shown in the movie very often but there is a picture in Micah's
: LC gallery which shows it from the side. Now I'm not really sure if he
: is a "Standartenfuhrer" or a "Sturmbannfuhrer" (also some kind of
: senior-colonel?).
: Bah, this surely gets confusing. Anyone who can identify the exact
: rank of this guy???

: Regards,
: -Max
standartenfuhrer is an ss rank for colonel guten tad ODIN

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: : : : : : : I can count at least nsistencies.  Editing, people.  Let's work on editing.

: : : : : : : -The Grey Wanderer-

: : : : : : I think that the General (Vogel) his rank is "StandartenFührer".
: : : : : : It's some kind of German Nazi rank but I don't know what the same rank in Englisch is. It could be General.
: : : : : : -Webley-

: : : : : :  Vogel was more likely not a General.  Wearing the black ceremonial uniform identifies him as an officer of the Schutzstaffel or SS.  If he was a general, he would have been referred to as Herr Oberst.  Hard to tell what the rank is from just "Standartenfuhrer".  Fuhrer is German for "leader".  "Oberfuhrer" would have been a major... Vogel was probably a lieutenant colonel or full colonel. -MP

: : : : I kinda always thought that Vogel was a Colonel so a "Oberst" in 
: : : : German. I never heard of a rank called "Standartenfuhrer" but I 
: : : : belive it's a term for the "leader" or the commanding officer of 
: : : : one regiment or so. I don't really think this is the same as a 
: : : : General. Also wouldn't a lieutnant colonel a "Oberstleutnant" and
: : : : so still considered "under" the (full) colonel? Just my two cents.

: : : : Regards,
: : : : -Max

: : : :Uhhgg.  Max is right. I think "Oberst" really is German for colonel.  Yes, a lieutenant colonel is indeed one rank below a colonel.  (Same thing in our Army.)

: : : Since the SS had names for the divisions (SS-Viking, SS-Adolph Hitler, etc.), I think Max is also correct that "Standartenfuhrer" probably refers to the leader of a specific SS formation.  I think there was one called SS-Liebstandarte or Liebstandarten. The easiest way to tell is by looking at the sleeve braid on the black uniform coat.  Inside the braid was written the name of the specific division to which the officer/soldier belonged. Hard to tell on the Vogel's uniform.  He doesn't stay in that uniform for very long in the movie. -MP

: : MP, I believe that "Standarte" refers to a number of units he commands
: : or so. Identifying his rank insignia is pretty hard indeed. Also does
: : he have such things on the kahki uniform he is wearing later in the 
: : movie? I really don't remember. Well anyway, I can't really see anything
: : useful on his cap. Also I'm not really an expert but I think he wears
: : some kind of close-combat badge on his collar. The shoulder thing isn't
: : really shown in the movie very often but there is a picture in Micah's
: : LC gallery which shows it from the side. Now I'm not really sure if he
: : is a "Standartenfuhrer" or a "Sturmbannfuhrer" (also some kind of 
: : senior-colonel?). 
: : Bah, this surely gets confusing. Anyone who can identify the exact 
: : rank of this guy???

: : Regards,
: : -Max
: standartenfuhrer is an ss rank for colonel  guten tad ODIN

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