Re: Part IV should not be as corny as Raiders and the others

Posted by RikDuel on December 01, 1997 at 00:00:58:

In Reply to: Re: Part IV should not be as corny as Raiders and the others posted by the guy on November 30, 1997 at 20:34:35:

I agree with some of what you say, guy, but not really as far as Raiders is concerned.
If things like the face-melting, sky-flushing scenes were throughout Raiders (as, to a great extent, they are in Temple of Doom), then I'd probably agree with you, but the thing is in Raiders, many of the characters, Indy most of all, are skeptics as far as the supernatural power of the Ark is concerned, and the audience is only given little clues here and there, of the Ark's actual power, as in the scene in the boat's hold where the swastika is burned away from the crate holding the Ark. The most noteworthy exceptions to this skepticism come from Indy's close friends, Brody and Sallah, whose warnings suggest the power that lies in the Ark.
When we come to the climax of the film, I think that it is essential to the plot that the Ark be shown to be an object of immense supernatural power, that the defeat of the villains come through their own attempts to harness its power.
The warnings of Brody and Sallah are justified and the Ark becomes even more significant. And the final warehouse scene, which I think is one of the most memorable in any movie ever, is significant because of the climactic scene in which Belloq and the nazis are destroyed.
While you may not have liked the climactic scenes in Raiders, I can't picture an outcome which would have been more satisfying then the graphic and gruesome destruction of the Nazis, through the supernatural power of the Ark.
Now, in Temple of Doom, I'm inclined to agree with you. First of all, I still struggle with it as a prequel to Raiders. Think the scene where Indy's packing his bags in Raiders. Where he says he doesn't believe in "hocus-pocus" or superstition. Huh?? After what he went through with the events in Temple of Doom, you'd think he'd be a little wary of "hocus pocus" and superstition, right?
Anyway, I thought that in Temple of Doom, while I liked it, there was just too much of the stuff of the Raiders finale. That kind of thing became too much a part of the movie. There was never a doubt in any viewers mind of the power that must lay in the Sankara stones.
The same again in the Last Crusade. We knew from two previous outings that the superstition was going to be on the money. And for Indy IV, I tend to agree. Let's move away from the magical relics, towards a prize which is valuable perhaps only in a monetary sense, in which the danger lies in fighting off rivals rather than magical dangers. If superstitions are going to play a part, let it come as a surprise, but I don't see how that could work given the nature of these films. We'll all be expecting it.
I'd like to see a film in which the prize and the plot is like an extended version of the preliminary sequences in all three films. The quest for the Peruvian Golden Idol. Dealings with Chinese Gangsters in order to obtain the ashes of an acient Chinese Emperor in exchange for a pricleless diamond. A quest for the Cross of Coronado, and a crooked art dealer or collector, who wants to keep it away from its rightful place - the museum. (Again, I like Temple of Doom the least of the three, it seems at odds with Indy's nature to swap something with such obvious historic significance for something with such an obvious monetary value, but nevertheless) These are the kinds of adventures I'd like to see in Indy IV. Lets quest for an important artifact for the museum, and have something other than the wrath of God (or Shiva) as the key to Indiana Jones' victory.

(Hey, 'the guy'. You the same guy from the viewaskew board?)

Dare(RikDuel)'s Indiana Jones pages

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Re: Part IV should not be as corny as Raiders and the others the guy 18:08:39 12/01/97 (0)

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:   I agree with some of what you say, guy, but not really as far as Raiders is concerned. 
:   If things like the face-melting, sky-flushing scenes were throughout Raiders (as, to a great extent, they are in Temple of Doom), then I'd probably agree with you, but the thing is in Raiders, many of the characters, Indy most of all, are skeptics as far as the supernatural power of the Ark is concerned, and the audience is only given little clues here and there, of the Ark's actual power, as in the scene in the boat's hold where the swastika is burned away from the crate holding the Ark. The most noteworthy exceptions to this skepticism come from Indy's close friends, Brody and Sallah, whose warnings suggest the power that lies in the Ark. 
:   When we come to the climax of the film, I think that it is essential to the plot that the Ark be shown to be an object of immense supernatural power, that the defeat of the villains come through their own attempts to harness its power.
:   The warnings of Brody and Sallah are justified and the Ark becomes even more significant. And the final warehouse scene, which I think is one of the most memorable in any movie ever, is significant because of the climactic scene in which Belloq and the nazis are destroyed.
:   While you may not have liked the climactic scenes in Raiders, I can't picture an outcome which would have been more satisfying then the graphic and gruesome destruction of the Nazis, through the supernatural power of the Ark.
:   Now, in Temple of Doom, I'm inclined to agree with you.  First of all, I still struggle with it as a prequel to Raiders.  Think the scene where Indy's packing his bags in Raiders.  Where he says he doesn't believe in "hocus-pocus" or superstition.  Huh??  After what he went through with the events in Temple of Doom, you'd think he'd be a little wary of "hocus pocus" and superstition, right?  
:   Anyway,  I thought that in Temple of Doom, while I liked it,  there was just too much of the stuff of the Raiders finale.  That kind of thing became too much a part of the movie.  There was never a doubt in any viewers mind of the power that must lay in the Sankara stones.  
:   The same again in the Last Crusade.  We knew from two previous outings that the superstition was going to be on the money.  And for Indy IV, I tend to agree.  Let's move away from the magical relics, towards a prize which is valuable perhaps only in a monetary sense, in which the danger lies in fighting off rivals rather than magical dangers.  If superstitions are going to play a part, let it come as a surprise, but I don't see how that could work given the nature of these films.  We'll all be expecting it.
:   I'd like to see a film in which the prize and the plot is like an extended version of the preliminary sequences in all three films.  The quest for the Peruvian Golden Idol.  Dealings with Chinese Gangsters in order to obtain the ashes of an acient Chinese Emperor in exchange for a pricleless diamond.  A quest for the Cross of Coronado, and a crooked art dealer or collector, who wants to keep it away from its rightful place - the museum.  (Again, I like Temple of Doom the least of the three, it seems at odds with Indy's nature to swap something with such obvious historic significance for something with such an obvious monetary value, but nevertheless)  These are the kinds of adventures I'd like to see in Indy IV.  Lets quest for an important artifact for the museum, and have something other than the wrath of God (or Shiva) as the key to Indiana Jones' victory.

: (Hey, 'the guy'.  You the same guy from the viewaskew board?)

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